I had such a great service experience! I was able to rent this beautiful new VW while they serviced my 04' Jetta that's still going strong! Susan Ahn, the service advisor was a gem to work with and their service technician personally called me to update me on my vehicle and my options. So glad I could continue to get to and from training at the Velo Sports Center safely (home of the 2028 Olympics)! *Not Sponsored. Just so happy to have had a great experience with kind and helpful people that weren't money hungry and rude. read more

Pacific Volkswagen - Car Dealers Near Me - Hawthorne, California

I'm sorry... But I had to pull over the moment I left and literally stop everything I was doing to write this review, because I think it's absolutely insane what this place does. I need work on my A/C, so after having it diagnosed, I have been looking around for different quotes on the parts and labor to be done. I figured, this is Volkswagen. I have a Volkswagen. Let's get a quote. Now, everyone knows dealerships are more expensive. Why? Who in the helm knows? It stands to reason that since they are the originators of all of these cars and their parts, they should actually be cheaper. But, they aren't. That's not necessarily a shock to anyone. I get it. What should be a shock to everyone? Is just how much more this place is charging. This is the second time I have come in here asking for a quote. The first time, I needed a latch for my trunk. The little lip cling mechanism stopped working for whatever reason? They wanted more than $400 for this one part. WITHOUT labor. I looked around for all of five minutes online. And found a genuine VW part for $100. Then? I found the same generic Parton Amazon for, $13.... You read that correctly.Thirteen.... Dollars! I thought I would buy the $100 part, and just get the $13 part to hold me over until I got paid next and then get the VW part. Thinking the $13 part obviously wouldn't last. That was almost three years ago. And turns out it was as easy as a few screws and a single connection to fix. And I did it myself in twenty minutes. Today, and the reason for this review? I have already gotten few different quotes regarding my A/C today. So, I know what the pricing should be in a general sense. Apparently, Volkswagen has absolutely no clue what it should be. These people gave me a quote for JUST LABOR. He said that his tech would have to come inside to give me a quote on the part. However, when he handed me the quote for JUST LABOR mind you, it was more than double what everywhere else quoted me, with the labor. That is insane! And everyone who thinks of going here? Should know that they are just FLAT OUT, POINT BLANK, NO OTHER WAY TO PUT IT, NO WAY TO DRESS IT UP, CALL IT WHAT IT IS, UNJUSTLY RIPPING YOU OFF. If you bring your vehicle here to be worked on? You either have more money than you know what to do with and don't care about wasting it? Or, you're a fool. There is no justification for these prices. ESPECIALLY in this economy. Their mechanics aren't four times better than other mechanics. And their parts, CLEARLY, as the evidence has shown me? Clearly are not worth 34 times what somewhere else charges. I genuinely can't not understand why ANYONE, would ever bring their vehicle here knowing how badly they are ripping you off. If you need your VW worked on? Helm! Hit me up! I will literally do the footwork of finding you a place for a small fee. And it will still come out to three times less what you would pay here! Guess what? Other places guarantee and warranty their work too. This dealership is nothing special. If you think otherwise? You understand nothing about anything. And need to have your head examined. Also? Since you have do much extra money lying around g around and just like giving it away? Hit me up. I need it more than you or them. I just HAD to let people know just how badly this place is ripping off their customers. They should be ashamed of themselves. It's disgusting frankly. Especially today. Gross. I don't need or expect charity. But I certainly don't need to be ripped off and insulted. You genuinely need to have your head examined if you read this and still bring your car here for work. The only thing I will say for them? Is that the employees on the maintenance side of the building have always treated me politely and friendly when I have shown up. So they have that. But that doesn't warrant paying four times what you would for the same work elsewhere. The employees on the car sales side for the most part have been cool as well. However, there was one guy the first time I was there looking who basically treated me like I was beneath him helping me. Though this was a few years ago. This review however, is about the maintenance department. So i will leave it at that. You either don't care about wasting money? Or you are simply clueless and foolish, if you bring your vehicle here for service. Nuff said. I had to warn the people. read more

I had a great experience working with James Le at Pacific Volkswagen! James was friendly, professional, knowledgeable, and made the entire process smooth and stress-free. He was very helpful, answered all my questions, and never made me feel pressured. I really appreciate his honesty and excellent customer service. I would definitely recommend James and Pacific Volkswagen to anyone looking for a great car-buying experience! read more

This is my second time leasing a car at VW Pacific with Jesus as my salesman! I traded in my Golf GTI because I was ready to go back to an SUV. Jesus made the process smooth and stress-free from start to finish. I test-drove the 2025 Taos and knew right away--it was the perfect fit. Jesus was professional, friendly, and patient, answering all my questions and making sure I felt confident about my decision. I left the dealership not only happy with my new Taos but also with a thoughtful gift--a cute VW dog plush and a coffee travel mug. Thank you, Jesus, for making this such an easy and enjoyable experience. If you're looking for a new VW, I highly recommend asking for him! read more

James was super helpful! I knew what I wanted and he was very transparent about what they could offer and making sure it was a better deal than I could find elsewhere. He even brought up some Costco rebates that I wasn't aware of. I didn't feel pressured to add on things that I wasn't going to need. He also made sure the process to return my last lease was streamlined so I wouldn't be charged extra by the inspector. Great experience, will be back! read more

We have been wanting to get my daughter a "mom car" for over a year now. Chris Estrada was so helpful and patient. Well yesterday was the day. He knew what she was looking for, took us right to the car. We did a test drive where he explained all of the features. read more

Pacific Volkswagen - Car Dealers Near Me - Hawthorne, California

I am filled with so much gratitude for how amazing the team at Pacific Volkswagen has been! I was referred to this location, and I'm so glad I was. A huge shoutout to Jesus, Aaron, and the entire team for truly going above and beyond to make the experience of getting my brand-new car so special! After being in a terrible accident two months ago, getting back into a new car was a big moment for me. I was fairly unfamiliar with the Volkswagen brand, but my new Tiguan is absolute perfection, and I couldn't be happier with my decision. I will absolutely be coming back to this location for everything and sharing my experience with close friends and family. Nothing feels better than receiving exceptional customer service and having such an outstanding experience when investing in something you'll have and enjoy for years to come. I truly can't thank you all enough. Thank you so much to Jesus, Aaron, and the entire Pacific Volkswagen team for making this experience so positive and memorable! read more

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Customer service started of perfect till I question why they wanted to charge me $116 labor to change a cabin filter and engine filter which I bought and changed in 5 minutes. I kept having to hassle with them for breaking my hood release and giving me the runaround I felt like I was being persuaded for up charges. They lost all my trust and loyalty, when I got home my hood release cable was broken took back 2 times for them to fix they took no responsibility or even partial responsibility they just want me to pay over $1000 to fix (parts $380) I WILL NEVER DO BUSINESS WITH THIS DEALERSHIP AGAIN! read more

It has taken me a while to sit with my experience at Pacific VW. First, the sales guy was friendly and informative. I did have to wait around a bit more than I would have liked, but he checked in as I waited, so the finance team was probably just busy. The financial team was a little slow in getting through the paperwork than I was used to, but there is a lot to check and process. Overall this first part wasn't bad, but I did spend a lot longer at the dealership than I would have liked. After buying out the lease, the one finance guy I worked with called a few times late evening to get some paperwork he still needed. Not sure why he had to call at 7 or 8pm, but that's fine. When I went to pick the car up a couple days later, the service team hadn't performed the annual servicing since the finance team didn't inform them to do it. So had to come back a few days later to pick up the car. The real problems came a week after getting the car. I was in an accident and the car was totaled. It sucked, and the finance guy at VW made it worse. I needed to work with VW to close out the loan they set up with the bank, cancel out the service contracts, and possibly look for a new car with them. I would call the finance guy, and he wouldn't return my calls. He had texted me, so I texted him, and he just would respond to call him the next day. He made me feel like I was inconveniencing him, even after he would call at night to get paperwork that he needed from me prior to the accident. After weeks of the finance guy not responding and not caring at all, I gave up on him. I only called the dealership when I knew it was his day off so I would get another finance team member to talk to. The second guy was much more caring and helpful. I scheduled a time, once again on the day the first finance guy wasn't working, to go to the dealership and sign all the contract cancellations. It took a few weeks longer for the paperwork to get processed, but it finally was all resolved. After the terrible customer service upon getting in an accident, I definitely did not return to Pacific VW for my new car. I didn't even get a VW I was so turned off by how badly I was ignored and treated. He got the car sale, got his money, and didn't care after that. If I had been treated with a bit of service and care, I could have turned around and got another car from them within a few weeks. I would have thought a repeat customer that quickly would be seen as an opportunity. If not for the second finance guy finally being helpful and kind, this would have been 1 star. read more

Great experience trading in my old Tiguan for a new 2026 Tiguan, Martin was excellent in reaching out and getting me to come in and then setting up a great deal with me. If you need someone to help you out, ask for Martin, he will make sure you leave happy. read more

Pacific Volkswagen - Car Dealers Near Me - Hawthorne, California

I had an excellent experience purchasing my new car here. Martin provided outstanding service and worked diligently to secure the best possible deal for me. I truly appreciate his professionalism and support throughout the process. Thank you very much. read more

Pacific Volkswagen - My new Tiguan - Car Dealers Near Me - Hawthorne, California

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This dealership has some of the BEST HONEST & CARING EMPLOYEE. Had my VW Tiguan serviced and Carlos very handsome, well spoken and listened to my ever concern. Now this is key factor. Informed Carlos of my concerns. Guesstimate time frame for oil and filter tire rotation, and lightbulb change. George the MECHANIC, didnt get to meet him. But my car is driving smoothly and I can tell my the way it stops. The way I go smoothly over the small humps on the streets. I love honesty and the fact that I saved a few a dollars as well. So yes, I tipped George my change. I wanted to do more, bc I appreciate GREAT WORK, & CHAIN OF COMMANDS. I purchased my vehicle here from Jimmy Nolte who I love and yes straight forward and won't play with your money. Community come on in if you need to purchase a vehicle, get a repair, or if you're just in the process of thinking about it. We want honest dealerships. No Im not a paid for this, Im an real time life customer. True Yelper. Im giving my honest review love my Community will always give my honest review to keep you updated. read more

Pacific Volkswagen - When my car was acting odd and tires felt oddly off. - Car Dealers Near Me - Hawthorne, California

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Thanks to Crystie L. (general manager) for turning my service experience around and getting me the attention and professionalism every customer deserves. Tony and JR really stepped up as well. My hope is that they will address the poor communication issues I had earlier with other staff and keep improving. read more

Warning! I would not recommend buying a used vehicle from this dealership. A while back, less than a year ago, I purchased a used Jeep Grand Cherokee which had been advertised online. Terrible idea. By the time I got home, the brakes were squeaking very loudly. Then noticed that the transmission was kicking between shifting gears. After having to complain and practically beg, I was eventually sent reimbursement for brakes. While at a very reputable well known mechanic shop, I was told a lot of bad and scary news. They said that it seemed like the odometer had been rolled back. That would explain the low miles for the year. I was also told that there is a common trick to temporary make breaks stop squeaking, and that was used on this vehicle. The mechanics said there is no way the vehicle had gone through any pre-sale inspection or fluid topping or anything. I was told this vehicle should have been sent to wholesale or an auction. Since I bought it used, there was no warranty included. They had me in a tough spot. After weeks of dealing with the sketchy salesman, the lying hard to reach manager, and the rude, cold, pennypinching general manager. I was finally able to make them return it. Then just when I thought it was over, I had to deal with an incredibly rude woman in the finance department regarding the check. I would've thought she would've been nicer considering what they put me through. I was finally able to finagle a refund out of them. I was provided with no compensation for any of the time and effort wasted. I had been driving from over an hour away each time so it was incredibly frustrating. They never owned up to anything. When I went to return the car, I told the guy I returned it to, everything the mechanics had said and he just shrugged it off and didn't say anything. There are endless places to find a used car. Avoid this place! read more

Bought a Certified-Pre-Owned ID4 for a fair price with low mileage and was treated well. Jesus (Salesperson) and Berdj (Finance and Closing) were great! They both own ID4s which was reassuring. Berdj told me about his experiences with being an EV owner and I appreciated his frankness and down-to-earth personality, then Jesus took time out of his schedule to walk me through the basics, and customization of my preferences with the car and I really appreciated that. He also made sure i had all my necessities so it felt like a New Car experience despite it being a CPO. Overall, I'm happy with the car, and I'm happy with my experience at Pacific Volkswagen and would definitely recommend PVW to both new and used car buyers. read more

Pacific Volkswagen - Pacific Volkswagen, 2023 Volkswagen ID4 Pro - Car Dealers Near Me - Hawthorne, California

I inquired for a simple request of a receipt of my most recent service performed at this dealership. After days of emailing back-and-forth with Martin Leon, my request has still not been answered. I even followed up multiple times with phone calls only to get patched through to his voicemail option which was marked as full and could not reach him over the phone. I am very disappointed with the overall poor customer service and lack of communication by this dealership. read more

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I have an electric VW. The service light came on. There is nothing to service on an electric VW except change air filter and fill up washer fluid. I only wanted to change the air filter and they refused to reset the service light unless I paid an additional hundred dollars to fill up the washer fluid highway robbery. read more

PACIFIC Volkswagen is my go to dealership. Susan A is an amazing agent and always takes care of me and my needs with my car issues! She is phenomenal at her job. Crystie Lucero is the general manager there. Thank you for having such a great and professional employee !!! . I will be back read more

I've been getting my car serviced here since i bought it and even though its a bit of a drive for me, I wouldn't take it anywhere else. Taidy is the best. I usually schedule my service online and she gets me set up. This time I was desperate because I could hear my brakes . I called her in the morning and she scheduled me to drop my car off by that afternoon. All the service people are great. As soon as i walked in they asked if I needed any help or if I was being helped. This is what good customer service is about. Bring your VW here. It'll be worth the drive. Nice clean waiting area. Fresh coffee. read more

I had an amazing car-buying experience at Pacific Volkswagen thanks to both JAMES and RICKY! Also, CRYSTIE the manager made it happen with the numbers! From start to finish, they made the process smooth, transparent and genuinely enjoyable. I purchased my second Volkswagen here. I couldn't be happier with my decision. James and Ricky were both knowledgeable, patient and never made me feel pressured. They took the time to answer all my questions, walked me through the features of the vehicles and ensured I got the best deal possible. If you're looking for a hassle-free and professional car-buying experience, I highly recommend JAMES, CRYSTIE and the entire sales team at Pacific Volkswagen. I'll definitely be coming back for another VW! Also, a huge shout out to the service department. SUSAN AHN, is my go to person! She always makes it easy to drop off and pick up my vehicle when due for service. Ask for her! read more

Pacific Volkswagen - Car Dealers Near Me - Hawthorne, California

I had an amazing first experience with my lease at Pacific VW. James was the best salesperson I could ask for. He made the process seamless and I got everything I wanted. Berdj in the finance department was awesome and explained everything thoroughly. Shoutout to the entire team for my experience today! I left with no regrets and a very happy new VW customer. read more

I had the BEST experience at Volkswagen Pacific! Martin is incredible and beyond helpful! Made sure everything worked with my budget and went above and beyond for me. I came in again because the rails on the roof were creating a noise. It was a Sunday and the service department was closed. Jesus came out and helped me take the racks off my new car. He was such a help! An absolute gem! Everyone here truly operates as a team and made an exciting yet stressful experience as painless as possible. read more

The dealership has Very unprofessional sales and service crew. BUT! They also have some really awesome service workers who will give you an under the table cash price to fix your car at their personal home read more

Great car dealership experience! I have been looking for great deals on EV car and was so lucky to find Pacific VW . They offer a fantastic deal! We had a pleasure of meeting Martin Leon! He's a very good person & great salesman! He was honest, punctual and dependable! we were treated very well! He made the process of Leasing a car smooth and efficient ! This dealership is a gem in Southbay! Please check them out! They will not rip you off like other dealerships but they will treat you with outmost respect! we are blown away and so impressed with all the staff Especially our favorite, Martin!!! thanks everyone! I'm Loving my new ID4!! read more

The customer service was fine, but like all dealerships, you take your car in for a recall and they're suggesting thousands of dollars in work. The added bonus here is that you get your car back and it smells like a frat party. Not sure what's worse: explaining to my kids that the car smell is marijuana, or the idea that someone was high when they "repaired" my car. Will contact corporate. read more

Management ignored my formal complaint. Avoid if you value basic professionalism. I reached out to Pacific Volkswagen and was referred to a sales representative named James Le. I took the time to answer his questions and clearly explained what I was looking for. After that initial exchange -- nothing! No follow-up, no update, no acknowledgment of the conversation. I followed up by email asking whether he had decided not to move forward. That message was ignored too. I get it -- not every deal works out, and not every customer is the right fit at a given time. That's business. What's not acceptable is being left ignored after engagement has already begun. A simple "we're not able to help you right now" takes 30 seconds and preserves your reputation. Silence doesn't. I then escalated by sending a formal written complaint directly to dealership management. That was also met with complete silence. No acknowledgment, no apology, no effort to make it right. Car dealerships run on trust and repeat business. The way this was handled tells you everything about how this dealership views potential customers once they decide you're not worth their time. If you're looking for a place that treats you like a person -- look elsewhere. On the bright side, Galpin Volkswagen were more than happy to help me. If you choose to work with them, ask for Brian! Tell him I sent you. read more

I had the most excellent customer experience here I worked with Earv who was a consummate professional and made the experience, totally turnkey. It was seamless and so easy. He went above and beyond in every way. He was totally knowledgeable, responsive and got me into an upgraded lease. I would highly recommend! This was truly what a white glove experience is supposed to be like. read more

Carlos is so nice when you pull in! It sets the tone (no one wants to get their car serviced) it puts you in a good mood! Marisa and Carlos are so personable and professional - you feel heard and taken care of. Bravo to the only VW location I actually enjoy and I've been to them all! read more

After my car was stolen, i was both dreading the process of having to find a new car and kind of excited. We did tons of research, watched a millions of videos before we narrowed down what we wanted. In the process of narrowing down, I think I walked into this dealership like 3 times. The first time I met James, and explained I just wanted to sit in the car to see if my husband would fit, as he's tall with knee issues lol. He didn't judge me just grabbed the keys haha!! The second time, I wanted to bring my hubby to see if he fit for real for real. He did!! We took a test drive but Hubs had more research to do. Now, we finally narrowed our choice down to the id.4 and it was time to pick one and test drive IT, but James was out that day. He still made sure I was taken care of by Chris! We tested a car, but didn't love the color. They had the same model getting ready to be put on the floor but didn't know when it would be ready. This is where the Sales Manager Jen comes in. I SUSPECT she had a hand in making sure that car went through the process quickly so we could see it, but they are too classy to admit that so who knows? All I know is that the next morning bright and early I had photos of the car and I knew it was the one! We came in the evening, and gave it one last spin and handed over our credit card. We got through the finance process quickly and I got to come home with my new vehicle last night plus a few extras ;) Imust say that out of all the dealerships we visited, they were the most professional, honest and helpful. James, Chris and Jen not only worked as a team to make sure I got the best customer service, I walked out with the car I wanted, at the price I wanted and thats priceless. So proud to be part of the Pacific VW Family! read more

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Had a great experience getting a new car! Martin was our sales guy and he made the process smooth and enjoyable. Me and my fiancé are proud to be apart of the VW family. read more

Me and my wife found the car online, I was lucky that Martin León answer my initial call, once at the dealership Martin took the time to show us the vehicle and very patiently explained all the features and and cleared all of our concerns on the 2025 Tiguan, he actually convinced us that was a great deal, thanks Martin! read more

Pacific Volkswagen - 2025 Tiguan r line - Car Dealers Near Me - Hawthorne, California

ZERO STARS FOR THE SERVICE DEPARTMENT! Worst service department ever! Rude and dishonest. We got a second opinion elsewhere and found out they were lying about the work we needed to have done. Saying we had multiple leaks when that wasn't the case. Go anywhere but here to have your car worked on! Got the work we actually needed done for a fraction of the cost. Also, they could at least be nice if they're trying to rip you off! read more

My check engine light was on on my new 2024 GLi with under 4k miles. Tried to call to make an appointment and no one would pick up so I made one online, no problem. Only AFTER I got there, did they tell me that it would take 2-3 days to diagnose the issue. The dealership is 8 miles away from my home and work and the closest VW dealership at the moment. I'm not sure what the point of making an appointment is if they can't look at your car for 2-3 days. Shouldn't they be limiting appointments to cars that they CAN actually service? I can't be without my car for 2-3 days since I have to take and fetch a child from school. They were unhelpful and now I don't know how to get my car fixed under warranty. read more

BUYER'S BEWARE!! I purchase my vehicle on 7/31/25. I had a great buying experience with Mr. Armin. Great salesman. The problem was when I went into finance. While in finance I met with Mr. Byron Zulueta. At first everything was going well until he showed me the purchase price breakdown. As I was reviewing the breakdown I noticed the APR was 2% less than what I was originally told. When I asked Mr Zulueta, he said he can give me the lower APR but I'd have to add an extended maintenance package. Not thinking, or focusing with the excitement I agreed. Yes, MY bad. On 8/4/25 I emailed Mr. Zulueta to cancel the extended warranty. Mr. Zulueta confirmed and said it would take 30 days for refund to be issued and it would be sent to the finance company. As of today 11/30/25 finance company has not received the refund. I take responsibility for agreeing to purchase the warranty but if I wasn't told I HAD to in order to receive the lower APR I wouldn't have purchased it. read more

As we pulled up, we had Martin Leon approaching us right away and in less than 2 hours we walked away with a brand new car. Such a pleasant experience. Martin is such a sweetheart and a professional. Definitely check this dealer out and if you can try to book an appoinment with Martin, do so. This is our second VW car bought at this location and both experiences have been amazing. read more

I was looking for a car for my 16 year old daughter and found a nice VW Golf online. So, I made an inquiry and James Le responded. My work requires a lot of time from me so I needed to do mst of it online James made it easy for me, sending me carfax and photos and answering questions. When I arrived to pick it up the car was up front and ready to go and all my paperwork was done electronically before arrival. James made it really easy for me. Looking for a new or used car James is the best. read more

I had the opportunity to work with Pacific Volkswagen. It was a pleasant experience I must say. The sales person, Martin Leon, from the first experience, looking at the car inventory to the final event of driving away with my choice, was the best, he was great. A true gentleman who did not push or pressure me. He was knowledgeable, personable and helpful and he managed expectations with professionalism. I am a retired sales professional myself so I expected to be handled like most car people do. Much to my surprise he was very helpful, patient and polite. We finished our business and he introduced me to the financial guy who also was patient and professional. I recommend giving this dealership the opportunity to show you and sell you a car. Ask for Martin Leon, you won't regret it. I love my SUV read more

1 Star - Unsafe vehicle, dishonest sales tactics, zero integrity This dealership is the definition of "sell first, disappear later." Within days of purchasing my vehicle, the brakes began making loud, disturbing noises -- the kind that immediately signal something is wrong. I reported this right away and was dismissed, told everything was "fine." It wasn't. Anyone with basic automotive knowledge would know these brakes were not normal, which means the issue either went unnoticed due to incompetence or was knowingly ignored before the sale. James Le, the salesman, was more than happy to push the car out the door, but the second a safety issue came up, his interest vanished. He showed no accountability, no concern, and no honesty -- just the classic behavior of someone focused on commission, not customer safety. Selfish and greedy is the only accurate way to describe it. Selling a car with brake issues and then refusing to acknowledge or address them afterward is unacceptable. Brakes are not cosmetic. They are a core safety component, and this dealership treated them like an inconvenience instead of a serious liability. If you're considering buying here, understand this: once the paperwork is signed, you are completely on your own. This dealership does not stand behind their vehicles, their word, or their customers. Do yourself a favor and take your business elsewhere -- or at the very least, get an independent inspection before buying, because trusting them was a mistake I won't make again. read more

I would like to be yet another reviewer praising the sales department at Pacific Volkswagen. Jesus was patient, caring, and thoroughly answered any questions we had. The atmosphere at Pacific was pressure free, which is both rare in the industry today, but very much appreciated. And a big shout out to the General Sales Manager Crystie, whose expedient follow through and assistance proved exemplary. I would never consider the purchase of a Volkswagen anywhere else! read more

Avoid leasing from Pacific Volkswagen at all costs. I came in 6,000 miles UNDER my mileage cap and was still told by Jennifer and Martin that my car had "no equity" and was "worthless." That's absurd for a low-mileage SUV in today's market. When I pushed for options, I found out why: Volkswagen hides fine-print rules that block you from selling your own leased car to anyone else. They trap you so THEY can take the resale value, even when the car is clearly worth more. So my choices were: keep paying for a car I'm done with, or pay the remaining balance just to walk away. Predatory, deceptive, and zero customer respect. If you value transparency or fairness, do NOT lease from Pacific VW. They will make sure you get nothing while they take everything. Bunch of ass clowns over there. read more