Such a fun night on Friday! The queens were amazing!!! Ivory Towers, Peaches, Destiny! My god those gurls can lips sync the house down boots! A great positive atmosphere with the correct amount of drag shade! Then the upstairs turns into a dance club with DJs spinning live music. All in all a fantastic night! Will definitely go back soon! read more

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I visited this bar on Halloween with friends--and it didn't disappoint! The energy is incredible, and the crowd is amazing. There's a $15 entry fee, but it's definitely worth it. They also have an upstairs area that opens around 11 pm, adding even more to the experience! read more

Crews & Tangos - Gay Bars Near Me - Toronto, Ontario

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Ryan, Pierson and Maha were amazing! Never had staff take such amazing care of me and my friends and on Halloween of all nights! Me and my friends will be back just to see them! read more

Out of all the bars we visited in Toronto, this was actually the one we liked the best. I might rephrase that statement to say it was the bar we disliked the least. Toronto nightlife just didn't seem to align with our taste, or maybe we just weren't in the know. This bar had fun drag performances and multiple dance areas. It was super crowded on the Saturday night we were there, so as much as we wanted to move from room to room to check out a different music vibe, it was hard to do so. We had to wait in a long ATM line outside to get cash to pay the cover fee, so we wanted to stay a while to get our money's worth but there wasn't much we wanted to see here. read more

Good spot to go for a variety of catching a drag show or dancing either in the back room or upstairs depending on your mood. I like the ability to move around watch a drag queen and then be dancing if I want. Be prepared however to bring cash and pay high dollars for your drinks. Taking only cash at the bar is a let down with a mostly cashless society. But having cash on hand for drinks means you have no excuse not to tip your drag queens. Staple in the village for a reason read more

I came here on Halloween and it was so much fun. All the queens were amazing! Such a fun time. read more

Crews & Tangos - a group of women dressed in costumes - Gay Bars Near Me - Toronto, Ontario

I am a tourist, haven't never been to Canada. This place had a lot of friendly bartenders and a ton of females... reminded me of pitchers (league of her own) a lesbian bar in Washington D.C. back home. The bartender was cool and explained to me everything about the max card usage or cash only. The reason I dropped my review was because of security removing us because we didn't have a reservation to sit on the tables. I didn't mind moving but I did tell them if it's reserved they should place bar rails or reserved signs...But other than that I had a good time! read more

Went for a friend's birthday on a Saturday and had a good time! This place was much bigger than I thought, and there were so many unexpected sections! First off is the main stage when you walk in, can't miss it! They have the live show here with the drag queens which was just too good! They played a lot of throwbacks and we got my friend up on stage since it was his birthday! Next up, the upstairs! Went looking for a dance floor, and this was it! Awesome music and best off, they had fans blasting up there! After that, we found the patio! This part I feel was definitely tucked away, but well worth the find. Great area to visit when you just need some air and a break from the crowds. Finally there's the back bar. Never been to this section yet so looks like I'll have go again to check it out! Overall, fun night! The only reason I give it a 3/5 is that this place gets crowded, and since there's so many sections, you have to wait in lines for each one since they all have a limit.... read more

Always a great gay old time with the boys love you all hope to see you again. With love

Me and my friends went there for a birthday party and OMG, SOOOO much fun!!! The drag show was amazballs, the saturday show with Devine, Tynomi with the amazing face and body and the 3rd one, I don't remember her name but she was chubby and smelled like baby air freshener was good too read more

Would HIGHLY NOT recommend. Unless you enjoy unprofessional, rude service. Right off the bat, was treated unprofessionally by the young, blonde female bartender; She gave me so much attitude, I thought it was a prank. Never did I do anything to deserve such treatment. Security sucks too. Considering they sided with her. It was all so ridiculous. It was my first (and only) time there too! What a shame... read more

we walked in, queen asked who is straight and everyone cheered, with peace and love go to your own bar (especially you bachelorette parties) However, it got really fun afterwards. The gays came through with the vibes and it ended up being really fun, upstairs was still overrun by straight couples taking over a space that isn't theirs, it is very uncomfortable for everyone. the rest of the club was so much fun, the music was fantastic and the bartenders and DJ's were all v hot; the drag show as also great. read more

Had such a fun time here one night, came a couple weeks later & I've never had such a rude security experience in my life. Came with a group of friends (all white girls excluding myself), left the venue for 10 minutes to ensure a friend who lived nearby got home safely, & came back to unnecessarily aggressive security guards who very rudely refused me entry -- my friends were still inside, so there was a brief point after attempting to explain the situation where I assumed the guard was signaling for me to come in (held the door open & made a hand gesture). I walked in & met up with my friends, only to be the only person in the group forcibly escorted out. There was so much scoffing & condescension from the security guards as if I'd actually done something wrong -- in reality I was just trying to reconnect with the friend group I came with (who I had invited to come out to this place). Blatant disrespect & a strong air of racism from security -- I wanted to become a regular at this venue, but so disappointed. read more

Crews and Tangos Be ware of some crazy lesbians, as they are impatient. I was in the bathroom, and one of them was knocking on the bathroom door constantly. When I got out, she pushed me against the wall and I pushed her back; than, I was tackled to the ground by a security Guard twice my size. He pinned me to the ground and kept pushing my face to the side. I tried talking to him, but he wouldn't listen to me. I was escorted out of the club in a manner befitting a criminal. Is there a double standard? Was I supposed let both her and a friend harass me? I find the security guards at the bar rough, and not willing to listen. They react before understanding the situation. read more

Crews & Tangos - This was as a result of my standing up for myself because I was being harassed by two lesbians. - Gay Bars Near Me - Toronto, Ontario

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The drag show was great and everything was very fun. But the door man charged us for one extra person which angered us when we realized he'd pocketed 5 bucks from us when we talked about it the next day. Our party was large and the first person from our party paid the door man a $20 and a $10 for the 6 of us at 5 bucks each. And then he charged me another $5. That was not cool. I contacted the club later and they said they would look into it but unfortunately there was no retribution to me as the client. The music on the second floor was fun but kind of cheesy remixes of dated songs. It might have been better if it was 2011. Regardless we had fun, but the same best got redundant after a while. Honestly I like the drag show and the personalities but I don't think I want to go back after that. And a lot of the clientele that goes here can be very elitist and catty so the energy can be really judgemental. I hate to be so critical but I hope they change these things so we can come back and have a better time next time. And I'm hoping that I can coordinate with the manager or something so at least I don't need to pay for cover because I overpaid last time. read more

Crews & Tangos - Ivory towers. So pretty gurl! - Gay Bars Near Me - Toronto, Ontario

Crews and Tangos is the most lively gay club from my experience in Toronto. Sadly, this is not a place I would count as a solace for gays in the community. This business is predominantly patronized by straights. In moderation is fine, but when 2/3 of people you see at the club are straight females/couples, it takes away from the queer atmosphere and safe space a gay club should be. I feel as though this is a straight club that has drag performers. The drag performers have energy and personality, which is appreciated, but I would not consider this a highlight of gay culture. For the best Toronto has to offer, I guess this is it, but for international folks, I wouldn't hold my breath. read more

I used to love Crews and Tangos but recently it has changed. It used to be my go to in the village for a night out with good music and good vibes, but I no longer go as I feel extremely uncomfortable. As a gay women I go to gay bars to feel safe, but the last several times I have been getting harrased by straight men trying to fondle, grope and grind on me while I'm dancing. They rarely respect when it is made clear you are not interested and security does nothing. Many of my friends feel the same and rarely go there anymore, instead favouring smaller, more exclusive parties. I would give 1 star but I still enjoy the drag shows occasionally, and I have so many good memories. read more

This has been my go to gay bar since I started going out on Church St. If you're looking for variety this is it. The main stage is the drag show and probably the bar's most popular area. There's some amazing local talent and plenty of queens who've won all sorts of awards for their superb drag. Try to go on a night where Ivory Towers is performing if you want to see a killer show. If you're into belting Adele, Avril Lavigne and Whitney Houston stick around till the very end - things get pretty wild when the show's wind down at the end of the night. The back room is usually a top 40 dance floor with lots of crazy lights and gays galore. If you're looking to dance your ass off this room is the place for you. On weekends it takes a little while for this room to pick up but it's always a lot of fun. On weekdays the room is occasionally closed, but on a Thursdays they do have live karaoke going on. Upstairs is once again an entirely different vibe. DJ depending the music is usually of Latin flavour and this is the area more straight people seem to congregate. After midnight there's almost always a line to get up the stairs and usually isn't worth it as the dance floor gets so packed you can't really move, let alone dance. The outside patio offers you a breath of fresh air and a break from all the craziness inside. Perfect place if you just want to sit and talk with some friends. (Usually open May-Sep weather permitting). Overall this is my favourite bar on Church st and definitely has the highest lesbian population on the regular. read more

Crews & Tangos - a group of friends taking a selfie - Gay Bars Near Me - Toronto, Ontario

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We were at the club in mid August, and seriously it was the worst experience I've ever had out partying in Toronto. Rude, pushy, security. The club is beyond filthy, smells like mold and pee, the upstairs washroom reeked of cum. Trashy, pervy, boring, outdated drag shows, terrible music. Save your money! and go somewhere else! read more

Terrible. Refused entry to me even though I spoke coherently and clearly stated I was drinking. I'm from the states and I felt it was judgmental to that. Bouncer kept telling me I was lying and to be "honest"'and I was. I've never felt so offended by a place in my life and for a bar that's supposed to be open and accepting I felt pretty offended by how I was treated. read more

Unfortunate. Poor management, horrible alcohol, not able to do tabs on a credit card. 20 dollar minimum to use credit card. Security guard with inept intelligence. I wanted to pay for my one shot of alcohol for twenty dollars because of how poor the shelves of liquor were stocked. While leaving the establishment the bouncer made sure to tell me that Rolling "marijuana" in the bar is against their policy. However I was making a cigarette. He couldn't wait to tell me he had me on their security camera footage rolling my tobacco. If you have rules and regulations why not post them on the front door. Can't wait to not come back ever again and talk about my experience. read more

Been here twice now. The nightly drag shows are always a great time, and as the evening progresses the crowd grows gets wild. The drinks are fine and service at the bar is fast. Bring ear plugs if you plan to spend your evening here, the music from the drag shows can be deafening. There are only a few places to sit so come early if you don't want to be standing all night. The environment is super welcoming and the crowds are often very diverse. Both times I've been here I've had an awesome time! read more

Crews & Tangos - Helena Poison - Gay Bars Near Me - Toronto, Ontario

2 stars removed for getting my shit stolen here, twice. 1st time in July 2011, my purse stolen by a guy who chatted me up and claimed he worked at the club but was on his night off. Proceeded to snatch it when my back was turned (seen by two girls standing near by) and disappeared. Reported it immediately to the security who claimed that no one by that description worked at the club (I was able to describe the guy down to his tattoos) but with the cameras they would be able to review the footage and see where he went. Minutes later, another guard (one I was passed off to) proceeded to claim there was nothing they could do and to call the club the next day. Huh? Called back, repeatedly, no one ever picked up the phone. Showed up a few days later when the club was open during the afternoon, the manager claimed no one could help me - and that there were no cameras in the club. Ok... Needless to say this didn't stop me from returning, I was just more careful with my purse/belongings and keeping my wits about me. Until last week when my friend and I put down our jackets upstairs by the stairs on a nearby table to buy a drink, turned around and found them gone. Reported immediately to security, was passed off to 3 or 4 guards until the last told us nothing they could do, to check the coat check at the night's end. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice... but still, you wonder with all the security, witnesses and "cameras" that the staff might not very well be in on it? Won't be coming back, despite a good dance floor and the drag shows. There's places on Church with the same entertainment and significantly less chance of victimization. Fail. read more

For those in a rush, the summary of this bar: - Popular on Fridays for some reason - Pointless $5 cover with a surly doorman - Insane wait to get drinks and even worse to move from one room of the club to the next - The club is ruled by bouncers who will push patrons doing no wrong around and "ban" you for no reason whatsoever - A complete waste of time and money better spent at any other establishment on Church Now, on to my full review... This dump gets the privilege of being my first Yelp review. I am not a big club fan but I will generally head out once or twice a month. Although I have been to Crews dozens and dozens of times over the years I can assure you that after last night I will never return; but I will get to that a bit later in this review. Let's start with the basics. For some reason I fail to understand, this dive is the "hot spot" in the village on Fridays; espescially with the under 30 set. There is a mediocre drag show in the front of the bar...see it once, and you've seen it a million tomes. The second floor is a much more urban vibe and crowd. The back room plays top-40/R&B. ISSUE #1 - LINES: The first issue I have with this place is that there are lines everywhere (and I'm not just talking about the kind people are surely doing in the bathroom stalls). Even if the club is dead you will find them controlling entry to get in, for paying your $5 cover to the most surly man I have ever seen, to check your coat (mandatory during winter months), to get to the patio, to move from one room to the next, to get a drink , and to get upstairs. A good part of any night at Crews will be spent bored in a line. ISSUE #2 - RUDE AND ABUSIVE BOUNCERS: Worse still is the incessant power trip and forceful demeanour of the bouncers in this place. Never in any club (let alone in the village) have I seen this level of overkill when it comes to security. Pushing patrons, yelling at people in line, physically blocking doorways. An absolute mess. I understand every bar needs some level of security and to maintain restrictions on capacity, but this place is nothing short of madness and is the same story whether the club is at 10% occupancy or 100%. ***Now, the reason I was prompted to write this review in the first place.*** ISSUE #3 - DISCRIMINATION: The aforementioned bouncers appear to have a habit of discrimination and exclusion, based on no criteria whatsoever. Last night (Friday, July 24) I was here with 3 of my friends, I had grabbed my first drink for the night, and we headed to the back room. In the midst of conversing with my friend, out of nowhere 2 guards approach me and push me to the exit. These same bouncers proceeded follow me all the way through until I left the fpremises and told me never to return. No reason whatsoever was given for this. As mentioned, I was sober (save for that first drink I had in my hand upon being approached) and minding my own business with a friend. I have been to this bar literally dozens and dozens of times and have never had anything like this happen or cause any trouble in the past. I was glad to comply with bouncers' orders as I am not one to start a commotion or cause any issue...however I find it incredibly disturbing that they feel the need to discriminate and remove patrons for no reason and with no explanation given. I have also heard from several friends that similar things have happened to them. The bouncers at this second-rate dive need and ego check. The whole place is really a mess, and a waste of time compared to any of the alternative options readily available on Church street. SUMMARY: AVOID THIS DISCRIMINATORY, LINE-PLAGUED DUMP OF AN ESTABLISHMENT AT ALL COSTS! Your leisure time and money are far better spent elsewhere. read more

Crew's in my go to spot on saturday nights, friday night, sunday nights, monday nights...basically it's awesome every night. My favs about this bar : 1. The patio. Its huge. 2. The 2nd floor. Great music to dance to. They even had a reggae dancehall night and that was amazing. 3. The back dancefloor...I've only recently discovered it. Its awesome. 4. No Cover/Only 5 on Saturdays!! Cons: 1. On the weekends, line ups get crazy. And I mean lines for everything. To go to the patio. To go upstairs. To get in. To get out. To drink. Not their fault though. Come find me here most weekends and sometimes on weekdays :) read more

I heard great things about this place and we were excited to go and see for ourselves ,but the staff is very unprofessional and they need to learn how to treat their customers. We got kicked out because there was a mix-up about reservations we had made ( and it happed before) . Instead of apologising when we voiced our disapproval , the head of security decided the best form of action is to deny us entry. The staff was very rude and disrespectful and I would not recommend this place for this reason read more

I've gone several times to Crews and every time my experience gets worse. The first time I went, I went outside to say goodbye to my friends and I wasn't let back in because they claimed I was drunk when I only had two beers. The thing is I wasn't even kicked out, I went outside by myself. It was pouring rain outside and they wouldn't let me stand under the roof until my ride came, so I left soaking wet after some verbal altercations. Another time I went with my boyfriend and we were both standing at the bar to get drinks. With my back turned I was scooped up by 3 bouncers and literally thrown out the backdoor by the dumpsters. I couldn't even call my boyfriend and his back was turned and my phone was left on the bar. He didn't see me get dragged out and was scared I got lost, while I begged and cried to just talk to him, but they wouldn't open the door for me. In the end I had to ask a stranger off the street to borrow his phone so I could call my boyfriend. I asked the bouncers over twenty times why I was kicked out, but I wasn't told. I assumed it was because of the incident the first time I came; they still let us come in at the start though, which puzzled me. Note: It is against the law in Canada to use physical force to drag someone off your property before verbally asking them to leave first. It is considered assault or battery if the person is not verbally asked first, because the person is only considered trespassing if they are asked to leave but refuse to. Either way, I can honestly say Crews has the worst bouncers I've ever met my whole life. Apart from being filthy disgusting with the grossest floors and bathrooms I've ever seen at a club. The music is old, boring, and overplayed, and the drag queens are extremely rude, unprofessional, and very amateur. If the drag queens were being rude for comic effect, it definitely did not work because no one found it funny. If I could give this club a zero out of five I would. read more

If top 40 music, cheap drinks, DRAG QUEENS, patios, dancing, karaoke, cute gay boys and sexy lesbians are your thing? This place is for you. This can also be a great place for you to bring some of your straight friends wanting to dip in the scene for the first time... very fun and entertaining. __ TOP 40 MUSIC all around. I hate it, but you know.. it's good to dance to especially when you are already pissed drunk and kissing up to your gay boy friends and lesbian girlfriends.. WHOO. __ CHEAP DRINKS are awesome! $5 bottles of beer and they sell pitchers too, under $17. What a deal. I usually only come in with $40 and I am already set for the night! __ DRAG QUEEN DIVAS? Guuurl! Better fix your weave, they will out-fierce your crusty, basic ass. They are awesome, friendly, very entertaining and very very very FUNNY. Daytona Bitch, Brooke Lynn Hytes, and Ivory Towers are my fave girls... they're FAB-U-LOUS. __ DANCING? Upstairs for me, meh. It's alright. The dance floor at the back though? That's where you break a sweat. Loooooove the music at the back and the crowd! __ PATIO... oooou my favourite place! Especially during the summer time! It is like the confessional booth.. where all the drama happens bahahaha. They have a bar outside as well during the warm season... and plenty of seats for you to sit your fat or flat ass with your sweaty, inebriated, and horny friends. __ The line ups can be long during weekends but they move fast. The cover is only $5 on weekends and free during weekdays! Overall, I love the place. My friends love it so much that they go almost every week. I however am getting tired of it. I like the place a lot, but we've been going here too much lately. I need a Crews and Tango DETOX, child.... XOXOOXOX ps. Free condom packages that promote safe sex in the washrooms that says "IF YOU WANT TO FUCK". LOOOOVE IT. read more

Good: Love the performers and fun atmosphere. TERRIBLE: YOUNG UNPROFESSIONAL BOUNCER. I went outside for air and I was trying to make sure I had everything in my purse. There was thunder and lightening outside. He told me to go down the stairs and basically step into the storm. I explained that I didn't want to get struck by lightening and he told me to eff myself (real words though). This was around 11pm on Friday September 5th. I love this place, even bought the performers a drink, but this was truly unacceptable behavior. read more

Wow, I'm actually really surprised that this place has gotten bad reviews! I've never been to Crews and had a bad time, maybe with the exception of Pride, but to be fair, everything in the village is totally insane and inaccessible during Pride week, so why would Crews be different? I've rarely had issues waiting in line here, even when it seems long we're usually in within 5-10 minutes, I've never been searched here, they've peered through friend's bag but never anything more than you'd put up with at any other bar. Cover is either non-existent or $2, and drinks aren't cheap, but also not expensive. Music is pretty standard top 40's, only out front it's belted out by fabulously dressed drag queens, and in back/up stairs it's spun by some pretty decent dj's. People here are super friendly, so it's one of the few places that I ever go alone, because joining up (or making out) with randoms is always an option. As a final key point, it's super close to Wellsley Station & Yonge Street, so getting home on either the subway or the blue night is always very easy. read more

My hotel concierge suggested this place. Being from out of town, I expected people from Toronto to be very rude, but to my surprise everyone was so friendly with me and my wife. I never been to a place were people were so fun, caring, and very affectionate I must say. People must have thought I was famous or something because guys kept on coming up to me. Even my wife was quite the star, women we buying her drinks all night. People are so friendly here. I'll definitely tell my kids to come here when they visit Toronto this Summer. read more

I am such a huge fan of crews. I never realized what a cherry fairy i was UNTIL. My bestie (Abbas) frequents this establishment and at first i was all like nooooo i won't fit in! But i DO! Everything has an amazing time at Crews, the music is awesome, the drinks are mad cheap (a bottle of canadian is like 5 bucks, a bitcher of Keith's is like 17?). Upstairs has a tight dance floor with stages and the like, and bathrooms and a bar. The music here is hit or miss for me.... The main room has a stage for drag shows. SO FUN. These queens are fabulous. Coat check is also cheap - $2 bucks :D I will come here again and again to dance and to mingle with everyone and dammit gays are a friendly bunch, i've never had a bad time here!!! read more

This place was terrible. Not a great dance spot, weak drinks. Wouldn't let us get our coats of credit cards at 1:45, we didn't know the bar was closing and were just left out in the cold. Welcome to Canada! Would not recommend to any foreign visitors. read more

Five stars for the amount of entertainment and fun Crews provides each time I visit. BUT, overall it earns no more than three for its poor upkeep of the establishment. Cons: inaccessible entrance, ugly interior, and dirty (usually sticky beer floors). Pros: amazing drag every night! I've been going on Wednesday nights in the last little while and it's super fun each time. Nice small crowd, and entertaining queens. Also, the place can pack a large amount of people with its multi-levels. It's also not too pricey - no cover except on the weekends (even then, it's like $5?). Music - always easy to dance to, Top 40 tracks! If you are new in town, or just new to the gayborhood, I would definitely recommend hitting up Crews for a fun first time ;) read more

Crews and Tango is a pillar of the Church & Wellseley community. It's drag shows and reggae all weekend long. There is always something going on at Crews. On the weekends, the top floor gets rammed with girls getting down to hip hop and reggae, and the stage downstairs is rarely without a drag queen belting it out. If you're going on a Friday or a Saturday, make sure you get there erly if you plan on getting in. read more

Here is a coherent list of why incoherent me loves Crews: 1) the drag shows are always great entertainment 2) everyone is generally very friendly and accepting 3) no cover (or $5 on saturday) 4) three separate areas playing different music--don't like the vibe/beats in one room? just move to another. 5) djs usually on point, playing fun music 6) the girl who works coat check. be still my beating heart. going to crews always spells out a good (if not slightly fuzzy) time. so much so that I get periodic cravings for it when I am away from home. read more

Meh I've been here many times, and I think of it as a village fixture. I should like this bar, but its somehow failed to be great. Drinks are okay, mediocre I suppose, I've never once been impressed by quality or service. Had a few negative experiences with service, and no positive ones -- I'm always shocked that bars in the village treat their patrons so badly -- why pay money to be treated awfully by bar staff? Seems that this sense is confirmed by other patrons experiences too. The space is cool enough, but I never really have a good time here. My predominant memory while being there is of wanting to leave. Id be willing to go here if someone wanted to, but I would not choose it. Patio is a big plus, and a draw. read more

Drag shows! Karaoke! Dancing! What's not to love? (It does get very busy and packed but there's a reason for that)

Crews is a great place to check out if you have never been to a gay bar before and need to slowly break into the scene. It's fun and lively with great entertainment. I love the drag shows and would recommend this place solely based on the quality shows put on by the drag queens. For the more experienced gay men, this is a bad choice. One of the big turn-offs are the straight security guards (there is an unusually high amount of security guards at Crews). It's not their "straight-ness" which seems to be a problem but their attitude towards gay people. I have often seen them ridicule and mock patrons of the bar. Crews and Tango is NOT really a 'safe-space' for gay people. The staff here see it as just another job and do not care if you are a gay person who has come to a gay bar to have a drink and unwind. It's purely run as a business with heavily marked-up drinks, rude staff, and long line-ups (they are everywhere...if you want to go to the dance-floor or catch a breather on the patio). In the end, I would say try it out but it's not the best place to hang-out if you want to hang out with other gay people without staff members breathing down your neck. read more

Look, if you can't have fun here then you can't have fun anywhere in Toronto lol this place is hilarious and the perfect place to go to celebrate a bachelor/bachlorette or birthday party. It's a divey bar for sure (the washrooms are unisex with urinals (eek!), but it's a safe and inclusive environment with reasonable priced bar rail and entertainment all night long. If you go during pride you'll see some pretty top notch drag performers, but the usual cast are a lot of fun and can carry a show themselves. Also, If you plan to use debit/credit there is a $20 minimum charge. I recommend starting your night here around 8:30pm (9:00pm cover charge starts) and then heading elsewhere after getting your fill of early 2000s pop hits and current chart toppers. I can easily spend 2 hours here. read more