I would just like to comment that there is absolutely nothing we can do at this point. Online shopping has sailed a long long time ago and there's nothing anyone can do. Hence malls even in the most beautiful setting, such as this one, was pretty much doomed to go under. There is however a new renaissance coming to Milwaukee and it looks very promising. Hopefully it can jump start this shopping center. I would totally love to shop here if there is any shopping at all. Maybe in the near future. Thank you so much for reading my review. I hope this helps with your decision making experience. Enjoy your awesome yelptastic day!!! read more

The Avenue - (",) - Shopping Centers Near Me - Milwaukee, Wisconsin

The Avenue, formally Grand Avenue Mall, has really had a face lift the past couple years. Its great to see what was a failing mall/glorified foot court a couple years ago, now a local attraction for locals and visitors. The Avenue has a lot of history behind it, once the only major indoor shopping facility in Milwaukee proper and the one time largest food court in Wisconsin, its great to see the thoughtful re-vamp of a historic part of Milwaukee. The newly re-branded Avenue is considered a shopping center, shared office space, and apartment building. While there are few retail stores, and plans for one or two more, it is not really a shopping center. Just on the other side of the building is a bustling food court wit many great options from local vendors. The many retail stores at one point have been converted to apartments, a creative way of keeping the historic look of the mall space. The space continues to have more potential and its great to see the history that still remains. read more

The Avenue - Shopping Centers Near Me - Milwaukee, Wisconsin

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CELEBRITY STATUS SALON AND BARBER........... So happy I found a place that's close to me which great service. And they are so accommodating it's great I got my braids out in just a few hours. They also can buy your hair great stylist this is officially my new spot read more

The Avenue - Celebrity Status - Shopping Centers Near Me - Milwaukee, Wisconsin

Located in downtown Milwaukee, I magine y his mall must have at one time been a huge attraction for visitors and shoppers. Alas, it seems the mall has fallen on hard times as many of the store fronts and a number of food court vendors are empty. We were there for the Jingle Bus Tour, and there wasn't much to see or shop for while waiting. The food from the food court was also pretty blah. Parking-wise there's an attached garage with signs that tell you to take your ticket with you but none of the machines in the mall we tried actually worked and we ended up just paying at the exit. Overall experience: Meh. read more

This is NOT a mall. This is a homeless persons shelter. Not kidding. At least they have a warm spot from the blistering cold. No food court was open. Only stores that were open was Walgreens, TjMaxx, Rainbow, and a phone fixer store. Place was huge! I don't get how they still manage to keep open. Second floor was all bare and empty. Outside of the "mall" had trails of pee on the snow from HOMELESS PEOPLE. read more

Grand Avenue is so......sad. When I was (much) younger, Grand Ave was THE mall. Two buildings were full of wonderful stores - Banana Republic, the Gap, Marshall Fields and more. One by one, they've moved out leaving Boston Store as one of the only viable retail options. Large swaths of the mall are completely deserted and most of the rest is junk. I can't blame stores for moving out - it's not an especially inviting space (especially the chopped up Plankington building) and they have the giant balls to charge for parking unless you spend $150. Hahahahahahahaha....like there's even $150 worth of stuff to buy. Basically, the mall functions as a food court and Walgreens stop for downtown workers. It's so sad, because it could be better. I really hope the city & owners figure out a plan to revitalize the space. It doesn't have to be retail - mixed use, restaurants, etc? There's so much potential when the mall is mere blocks from the convention center, downtown hotels and thousands of workers. There's been a lot of talk but very little action in past years - time to step it up! read more

This mall could be so much better, but hey, it is what it is and when I compare it to other urban shopping malls, it's actually pretty good. It has a couple of decent anchor stores. It has a food court with the usual suspects. It has clothing and electronics and jewelry and books and accessories and all of those things. And they keep it very clean and shiny with a solid security presence. Yes, I bought stuff. Not much, but some. And I got the guy in the jewelry store to replace the batteries in my watch. Is it great? No. Is it a decent shopping experience in downtown? Yes. read more

I travel often and this has got to be the worst mall I've been to. I went in for the sole purpose of tights and found them. Killed time walking through part of the mall and saw some sakes but the clothes looked like they should be given away. One salesgirl was even bold enough to say there's nothing in here. She didn't know why the store she worked in (don't wanna call her out) didn't close.) she was right but who says that to a customer? I wonder what they plan to do with all the empty space. A movie theatre would be nice Bc the mall has three levels. It's embarrassing to be downtown in a major city. Walgreens and the food court are all it's got going. The mini farmers market was a decent. read more

This Grand Avenue produce wagon (yes, it's a wagon permanently parked in the mall) is from the same purveyors as the Tropic Banana Company in the Third Ward. Peddler Jim's tends to have a bit more of selection that Tropic though, especially when it comes to vegetables. There is always something on sale, priced to move quickly. So if you can manage to use it quickly it amounts to a good deal. Some of my favorite regulars are: Button mushrooms, priced between $1 - 1.25 per eight ounce package. Berries (straw, blue, black, rasp) - sometimes as low at 2/$3. Rainier Cherries - limited season but a steal at 3.99/pound. Honey Crisp apples - also limited season and usually 3/$1. Bosc Pears - great deal at 3/$ most of the time. The cart is located on the first floor of the Plankinton side of the mall, just to the south of the TJ Maxx entrance. Parking can be a bit tricky, except on Sundays when the meters are free and spaces are more readily available. If you park in the mall structure you can get validation, but it still costs a couple dollars. And bring your cash, no paper or plastic is accepted. Bonus points for bringing your own bag and saving the Earth! read more

The Avenue - Shopping Centers Near Me - Milwaukee, Wisconsin

It's been two and a half years since my last review of the Grand. Time for an update! (... but not an upgrade.) See, the thing is that I almost feel as though the space itself represents and is indicative of Milwaukee's varied civic and cultural challenges. Scratch that. I do feel that way. I believe that to be true. Milwaukee is a city that's undergoing a cultural and civic rebirth, however compartmentalized and slow. In order for more... restaurants/culture, community engagement/ownership, and general awesomeness that we already have rocking here in the Mil, we need more... money. And people. *We need (responsible, tax-paying) companies to relocate to Milwaukee County and employ people who will in turn inhabit vacant apts and condos. In turn, then, more new businesses crop up for folks to patronize, and ultimately, we get more tax revenue to improve some of the issues that seriously plague our city. (Public transit, education, and lots, lots LOTS more. I could go on but I won't, because this really isn't the place for that.) (*see footnote) I get it, though. Solutions aren't easy and there's even more than that to consider as well. What should inhabit a space so large, a "mall" so "conventional" in layout but in the heart of the city's downtown? How do we convince those folks outside that proverbial line in the suburban sand of Milwaukee's merit? They should spend their money here, at restaurants like Crazy Water and Café Corazon, not at an Applebee's in Menomonee Falls. I digress. The Grand HAS seen some progress and rebirth since last I reviewed it; that's for sure... but it's not enough, and it's all cobbled together, haphazardly. Startup incubators are great, and I love the fact that the Underground Collaborative calls the Grand home; these are steps in the right direction... though again, it's not enough. There needs to be cohesion in concept and execution with a space so central to downtown Milwaukee identity. A friend challenged me yesterday to think about a solution for the Grand after I jokingly told him I was thinking about running for Mayor in a few years. It got me thinking. It's a tough sell, a solution to the Grand Ave. "problem," but I think it's a doable one with the right vision and investors. Maybe the start is already there? For now, enjoy that food court, the Stone Creek kiosk-y type location and easy downtown access to a Boston Store. Also, there's an Applebee's at the Grand, just like in the Falls, if you must. --- *I have some solutions and ideas that would encourage investment in the County/City and streamline civic government. Ambitious? Yes, but so am I. Local government needs a serious overhaul, and I'm your gal, Milwaukee. R Felly for Mayor of MKE, eventually! read more

Grand Ave, you provide disappointment after disappointment. Clearly the building itself has been redone in recent years. The floors are shiny, the architecture is nice, and the fancy spiral stairs with the water fountain are super classy. The abundance of $1 glitter stores and sub-par wigs are at the opposite end of the spectrum. My mom tells tales of the glory of Grand Ave past, and I tell her of the creepy, empty sadness that has taken over. The food court is pretty good, so it's nice to jaunt over for a bite if you are in the area. It's weird (but maybe helpful?) that Office Max and Walgreens live in here. For such a large, beautiful building it houses so little, and almost nothing of substance. ONE crappy department store and a crappy TJMaxx. Honestly, they are the worst options in their category I've ever seen. This mall is depressing. They have nothing I want, except space to improve. read more

Wow...the Grand Avenue is such a depressing place. It's a skeleton of what it once was. I remember as a little girl coming here with my grandma and this place was the premier place in Wisconsin to shop. There are some stores and offices left, but nothing that is going to attract the crowds like it used to. So much great space going to waste. I truly hope the new owners do something with this place and also listen to the community that lives in the area and use this space as to what should go in. My suggestions are a Target (Chicago utilized a space like this downtown), a market such as a Trader Joe's or a smaller Whole Foods and then make it into an entertainment area with some nicer bars and restaurants and maybe a bowling alley. Just my thoughts and from someone who lives in the area. read more

The Grand Avenue Mall is so sad, when it opened in 1981, and in the decade following, it was a beautiful mall with man high-end and flagship stores. Now it is maybe 75% full at the most, there are very few name brand stores, I think Layne Bryant and Boston Store were the few I recognized. What they have done with the Plankington building is just ptiiful, putting a TJ Maxx in downstairs and chopping up the building, blocking the grand staircase and putting glass over the second floor balconies. I know the changes were made to keep the mall safe and still viable, but it is very sad that they were not able to turn the mall back around. The only highlights- They have the best Milwaukee/Wisconsin t-shirt and gifts shop, "Brew City Beer Gear". The food court is still helpful if you want a quick bite to eat , though all the original eateries except for Grecian Garden have since closed and it is the same old, same old' chain restaurant fare. The Boston Store is very nice, and there is a Border's in the old Marshall Field's building, but everything else in between is a real waste of time. read more

Oh boy. This mall is the unhappiest little story one can ever hear of gentrification (or...the opposite of that?) There's nothing "Grand" about it, I can assure you. More like the "Shops of Sad Avenue." But hey, it has some redeeming qualities. TJMaxx, for one. Even wealthier folks living in the Eastside condos need their discounted goods! Office Max, sometimes (for their clearance bin!) Payless Shoesource, if you want a cheap but decent pair of slippers for the warmer weather. Walgreens, for your cough drops. Oh, and did I mention the mall is a GREAT place to walk through during the colder months, if only to get from one side of the river to the other? For downtowners, (and the occasional "transient," aka homeless dude) it is an absolute haven in the snowy and windy weather. And what about those random kiosks at the mall? It's interesting to watch ladies get their brows waxed and plucked, or imagine how bored the "computer/tech help" employee must be with his/her average .5 customers a day. And that hurricane simulator booth? Who doesn't want to experience what it's like to stand in wind gusts in excess of 60 mph? Seriously, though - the Sad Avenue might a little sad, but it's not completely unhappy, either. It's clean, it's warm during the winter, there's some food and there's some semi-useful shops. It has plenty potential to be a little less sad and a little more "grand." Only time (and a bit of brain power on behalf of its owners and the City of Milwaukee) will tell. read more

Great little fruit stand inside Grand Avenue Mall (steps from TJ Maxx). Reasonable prices with frequent sales (e.g. any combination of apples, pears or oranges for $1 - $3 for two packs of strawberries. Always fresh. CASH ONLY! read more

This fruit and veggie stand is fantastic. It's located in the Grand Ave. Mall, just outside TJMaxx, and I love to stop by on my way to or from the gym. If you head over close to the end of the day, he will sometimes offer special prices on select produce. The other day I bought four avocados, three oranges, two apples, two bell peppers, three cartons of raspberries and a carton of strawberries for $10.25. That's outstanding. While the size is typically fairly small, the quality is great. Bottom line: I definitely recommend checking the stand out, especially if you work downtown and just need a quick produce spruce-up. You won't be disappointed. read more

If you're looking for a space to open a business, Grand Ave is the place for you -- actually, if you were looking for 20 spaces to open multiple businesses, this would really be the place for you. So much emptiness. It's so sad to walk through here. It was pretty empty 10 years ago already, when I used to trek down Wisconsin Ave. as a college student to peruse the Old Navy and Linens 'n Things. It's become emptier since then. The food court is still bustling with people, especially on weekdays, so you know people do actually enter the mall. Perhaps what's more interesting is that, while the chain stores have mostly fled the space, there are a number of local salons, boutiques, and food spots that have moved in. It'd be awesome if more people frequented the shopping areas to keep these businesses growing. This place is okay -- it's just in a bit of a chicken-egg conundrum. People don't seem to want to visit because they think there's nothing here -- and businesses are likely discouraged that people don't shop here enough. If you can fix this issue, I'll be your biggest Milwaukee fan. read more

It was very fun even during Covid there are some great food choices!!! If you think you want to have fun,shop, and be social that's the place to go!! read more

As I was scrolling down some reviews this morning I saw one for the Grand Ave. This piqued my interest because I wouldn't have thought on commenting on this. I work close enough and find myself in here daily. During this time I have seen many stores close. There weren't a whole lot to begin with when i began frequenting but it's rapidly becoming a ghost town. The end with Boston Store contains a barbershop and a Payless and a host of empty storefronts. From what I have read and heard Payless won't be renewing their lease there. That really just leaves Boston Store on that end whose lease is running up. There has been speculation as to whether or not they will continue operating there. I can't see it being of any benefit to the company. As a destination point it currently doesn't make sense. Half of the fun of shopping in a mall is trying on different items, physically looking at different items and making a day of it for those who like to shop. There needs to be some sort of convenience factor. Are you really going to pay for parking to browse the ultra limited stores? You'd honestly be better off visiting Mayfair or Brookfield Square. This is no longer the destination point it once used to be. That makes sense as a lot of shoppers take advantage of the internet's low prices and often free shipping and don't have to deal with odd ball loiterers and crap shoot customer service. If it wasn't for the people working in the corporate offices and the adjacent Federal building I wonder who would journey here for the food court? I think that is really what brings the bodies to the third floor. The quick eats at Qdoba, Culvers, Subway being good for indecisive folks who can wander around before making a decision. The chocolate Factory has since left which is a shame because that was a better sandwich option. There is potential here. Encourage small business owners to occupy spaces here for discounted leasing? I'd rather see small businesses occupy the 1st and 2nd floor with area food places on the 3rd as opposed to chains. I bet that could make a difference. What does the mall have to lose? It's already bankrupt read more

I feel a little sad when I see this poor little mall. So much potential, so many empty store fronts! Its clean though, and has a few stores I periodically shop at. If this place had businesses in its shops it could really be a nice place to go. There's a nice produce shop on the first floor with good prices (between TJ Maxx and the empty store which is now a make a parade float thing). An okay Boston Store. TJ Maxx. Payless. Office Max. A food court and an Applebees. And many more places to frequent. In fact, here's their directory: http://grandavenueshops.com/directory.php I keep hearing how it attracts low class people and bums... I haven't really seen this phenomenon. Most of the people I see are regular Downtown folks shopping and/ or getting lunch. Yes, and the occasional homeless person asking for a handout, but there are a few in Downtown and I haven't seen them cause any problems. Don't be afraid of the nonexistent boogie man, you'll be fine. read more

I absolutely LOVE this fruit and vegetable stand. The produce is always good quality, and the prices are unbeatable at any nearby grocery store. It's usually the same man, who I can assume is Jim, running the stand, but sometimes a woman will be running the register instead. The service is always quick and friendly. They have everything from apples, grapes and oranges to peppers, potatoes and onions. Melons, strawberries, peaches, pears, plums, raspberries, baby carrots... you name it, they've got it. They only take cash, but there is a US Bank ATM right next to the stand. I have free ATMs, so not having US Bank doesn't bother me one bit. read more

It's really sad inside and the busiest hours are lunch, winter, and when there's a convention happening across the street. I think it's weird that they couldn't convert part of it into a movie theater for the downtown area (just have better management maybe?) or sell part of it so it becomes a downtown Target like in Chicago. They don't even use the empty storefronts very well; they could use it for advertising or putting up "fake" storefronts so it looks less empty and depressing. I like getting cheap accessories from Glitter and it's not so great inside but the people who own the downtown mall need to get their act together! read more

Over the course of the past few years, the shops of Grand Avenue have fallen from their previous position of grace with every emptied storeroom and painted-over sign. It is now left in a pitiful state of absolute disarray, what was once a wide selection of stores now a desolate graveyard of closed-off doors and empty displays. The few stores still present are limited, and mainly small independent dealers or businesses offering obscure services that hold very little use to the average shopper. On the (immensely limited) plus side, they do have a decently stocked Game Stop. So if you only wish to buy video games, you should be set. read more

I give you two stars only because of your convenience at lunch time. Walgreens then the Chocolate Factory for a chocolate malt. Perfect. read more

I think I was too nice last time. 2 stars was two too much. Come to this mall and find one person actually carrying a shopping bag, I dare you! No one shops! The mall has a whole ton of people doing a whole lot of nothing. Maybe we need to see changes implemented like other malls. No youth during school hours ( I see TONS of high school and even grade school children in there on a daily basis), no loitering...maybe we could make something of this place. It would also help if they just got rid of all the stores and started from scratch, but I think it may be a little too late for that. For those thinking of visiting Milwaukee, I suggest finding a hotel in the 3rd Ward or Walkers Point area and hang out there. If you are looking for shopping, sadly our downtown is not making the grade. read more

I walk the halls of this place at least weekly to get to the food court for lunch, but I'm only rarely tempted to try one of the stores. During the lunch hour, the hallways are pretty well packed, so walking with more than one other colleague isn't quite practical, though it is nice to have indoor walking paths when the winter winds start whipping through the downtown streets. read more

The Avenue - One of the central courts at the Grand - Shopping Centers Near Me - Milwaukee, Wisconsin

How great would it have been to have a mall in the center of the city that had the parking and stores necessary to keep people coming? I don't know the background, but this mall is a bit of a soup sandwich. The layout isn't great, nor is the general feel of the place. Some stores (Boston, TJ Maxx, Gamestop) seem to stay relatively busy, but others seem perpetually empty. How they stay open, I'm not sure. TJM is a great place for buying staples like socks, underwear and gym clothes for sure. You can find other random bargains dependent upon personal tastes, but those have been few and far between for me. Gamestop is staffed by pretty decent people who've been helpful and knowledgeable with their jobs. Boston store is pretty standard, not much to say other than to avoid expecting a Mayfair quality copy. I will say that the info desk seems to be perpetually out of bus passes for some reason. Kind of annoying. Much like this bus driver who seems to be needlessly pumping the brakes every 10-15 seconds as I type. WTF dude. read more

A nostalgic monument! Love coming to the T.J.MAXX to visit this beautiful historical building!

Seriously sad that this mall is going downhill so fast. I remember going here as a kid with my school to visit the food court after seeing the orchestra. the mall has such incredible architecture and decor. The food court is basically the only thing left. I am thankful for that because I usually go here for food during my lunch hour but I am sad to see that almost ALL of the other stores in the mall have closed. The Children's Place, Lady Foot Locker, and The Mirage all closed this month and now Border's Books is leaving too. It seemed to really start once Linen's and Things closed. Now TJ Maxx is the only big name store left in the mall. Nothing seems to be able to be able to stay open. I walk through the sky walk from the Federal building and then through the length of this mall to get to my car every day after work and there are basically no stores open in the entire length of the mall. The only ones open are a Cricket Wireless and Verizon Wireless. Plus a nail salon that I wouldn't go in if my life depended on it. Often times when I walk past the nail techs will be eating sandwiches off of the nail stations or relaxing in the pedicure chairs having their lunch. It's so disappointing to see this kind of thing happen to such a cool mall. I hope they can do something to have this place before it has to close all together! read more

Only had a TJ Maxx and Footlocker. All other stores converted to apartments. Do not recommend for a shopping trip.

Looking at some of the reviews you would think this is the worst place in Wisconsin...lol. Look this is by far not a great or good mall, but it does have some good spots. For one if you work in the downtown area, it is very convenient. You are able to go there for lunch (enough places to get a descent lunch) or to pick up a quick item on your break. They have a Boston Store, TJ Maxx, Wal-greens and a numerous shoe stores. In addition, they carry a T-Mobile store, Office Max, GNC, & Game Stop. So you can see there is definitely enough here to get some things done. With that being said, this is my last mall of choice when I'm not at work. I'm not necessarily a fan but definitely not bashing the place to pieces. Without it being there it would seriously limit my options during the week. Worth checking out for yourself. read more

Alas, Milwaukee's much-balyhooed Downtown mall has gone the way of nearly every other Downtown mall in these United States. Perhaps it's time to that we all recognize that when you shoehorn a suburban shopping paradigm into an urban center all you're going to get is mediocrity. It just doesn't work. Downtown Milwaukee is becoming an ever better retail destination. But it's happening in spite of, not because of, the Shops of Grand Avenue. I give it three stars because I am able to get a fair amount of shopping done here without having to deal with the crowds of other area malls. read more

Multi-floor mall, some stores sit empty, food court on top. I walked through the mall on my free time, sat up in the food court to write this review. read more

It's sad to see such potential go to waste. Oye, what to do with old malls? It's a curse that will plague my generation.

Peddler Jim's Produce is amazingly cheap. The produce is pretty good quality, too. It is usually close to ripe, so plan on using it the same day or at least in the next day or two. They also have over-ripe bags for $1, which are great for making quick breads or produce you plan on using immediately. We usually can't depend on getting specific items here for a recipe. Sometimes they don't have it and other times it just isn't ripe enough or over-ripe. However, it is perfect for snacks and picking out produce and planning a meal around it. If something is in season, there is an especially good price, but really everything is relatively cheap. It is cash only. There is an ATM next to the produce stand and several ATMs in the skywalks, such as Chase and Wells Fargo. read more

This place is only worth going for TJ Maxx or if you need to go to an easy to access mall since they're downtown and by a good number of bus routes. Their OfficeMax doesn't even carry desk lamps and their Walgreens probably has the most inattentive staff I've seen in any store - Note that you can walk up to a register and there won't be any cashiers available for quite a while. I also found their Boston Store selection to be very limited and I found some of their food court staff to be inattentive or rude. The mall layout is also rather poor since you'd have to access all the other stores past the TJ Maxx via the second floor and even then, their shop selection is haphazard at best. Not recommended, but as said, TJ Maxx is the only saving grace to this place. read more

I am actually an out of town visitor and I came here because I was looking for somewhere to relax before Summerfest. I came in here and expected a lot more than what I got from it. There aren't many women's clothing stores and the traffic in here is very low. The location and look of the place should allow for it to be a lot better than what it is, but it seems like it's just a walk through sort of place. A few stores that I went into didn't really have anything and there weren't really lots of good places to choose from. The lady who stands at the guest services stand is really nice though. She gave me tips on good restaurants and other sights to see in this city. I would recommend somewhere else to shop though. read more

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Don't waste your time... I hadn't been to the Mall in years and now know why. I can't believe such a beautiful mall has fallen on such hard times and is basically vacant. Couple of sports shoe stores, a Walgreens, at least the TJ Max seemed decent. Sounds like they are moving the food court down to the 1st level which will be nice. Hope downtown businesses and residents support it. read more

I work downtown so Grand Ave is my #1 stop during lunch walk breaks during winter. I feel secure here. Grand Ave has a bad rap in Milwaukee as unsafe. I feel like they have acceptable security. You can expect to be panhandled outside, though. Grand Ave does have a very extensive foodcourt with lots of different options, some are even healthy. This is a hot spot for downtown workers. They have a Wildflour bakery, this is also a plus. Stores include: Boston Store, Office Max, Payless Shoesource, TJ MAXX, radio shack. The workers are TJ MAXX are almost always unpleasant. The workers at Payless are always helpful and nice There are many empty store fronts. There is also a jewerly store, a US cellular, a hat store, Rainbow, and Indian store (I say this because they feature incense and saris), a Walgreens, and GNC (of which I am not a fan because everything is artifical). read more

I also remember visiting Grand Avenue when I was a kid. It was SO cool to go downtown (from Brookfield, about 10 miles away) to Grand Avenue. The mall featured shops in the old Plankinton Arcade, what my mom says was an early 1900s office building later transformed into a shopping area. There was also a modern part, that featured a third-story food court that used to have this big bear statue on a tightrope swaying back and forth over the diners. That was the kid's big draw to the mall. During the late '90s on the few times I headed down to Grand Avenue, I was sorely disappointed. There was a period when there was literally a few stores left in the whole mall. It seemed half empty, and there was almost no one walking the halls. It was eerie even. While its not the Grand Avenue of the 80's, with a new Borders bookstore, Linen's N Things and Office Max as well as some other chain mall stores, there is at least some draw to this mall. Sure, it's not what it used to be, certainly not a place to shop for clothes, but for books, home stuff or a TJMaxx fix, it serves a purpose. read more